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Definition of Violence Working Group

Chit chat, brainstorming, revelations, dilemmas, or anything that doesn't really fit anywhere else goes right here.

Definition of Violence Working Group

Postby Clevo Sam » Mon Dec 12, 2011 2:03 pm

This thread is for developing the definition of violence for the purpose of the Good Neighbor Agreement.
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Re: Definition of Violence Working Group

Postby Clevo Sam » Mon Dec 12, 2011 2:19 pm

Sorry for this taking so very long to do. I spent a lot of time getting insight from a number of folks regarding this and reflecting on the opinions that they offered. And then life got in the way and it honestly slipped my mind for awhile.

Anyhow, after taking the many discussions into account what I was able to synthesize is:

"Violence is the intentional initiation of un-consented harm against another human being."

Each word in this is specifically chosen. I had a better word for "unconsented" but my brain has misplaced it. If something needs clarifying as to why it was chosen please ask, along with asking over any concerns or disagreements.
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Re: Definition of Violence Working Group

Postby josephzitt » Mon Dec 12, 2011 3:32 pm

Maybe "non-consensual"?
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Re: Definition of Violence Working Group

Postby julia » Mon Dec 12, 2011 7:26 pm

I think it's a good definition, but when we actually get down to discussing specific situations I worry that this definition ends up hinging on the idea of demonstrating intent. (I'm thinking about this mostly in similar terms to "That thing you did is racist" vs "You're racist" - see: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0Ti-gkJiXc )

That being said, at this point I don't have a better suggestion for wording. (I'm assuming that intent is in here to exclude situations where you turn around really fast and manage to whack someone in the head or other actual accidental infliction of harm)
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Re: Definition of Violence Working Group

Postby EndGOP&DemDuopoly » Mon Dec 12, 2011 10:26 pm

Clevo Sam wrote:Sorry for this taking so very long to do. I spent a lot of time getting insight from a number of folks regarding this and reflecting on the opinions that they offered. And then life got in the way and it honestly slipped my mind for awhile.

Anyhow, after taking the many discussions into account what I was able to synthesize is:

"Violence is the intentional initiation of un-consented harm against another human being."

Each word in this is specifically chosen. I had a better word for "unconsented" but my brain has misplaced it. If something needs clarifying as to why it was chosen please ask, along with asking over any concerns or disagreements.


Clevo......by your definition of "violence", I would be committing violence by intentionally "harming" a person, by reporting to police that he committed a crime, resulting in the person being "harmed" by being jailed. I can give you other examples in which your definition would also be nonsensical when put into real life practice. So it needs to be better worded.
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Re: Definition of Violence Working Group

Postby 88BG » Mon Dec 12, 2011 10:48 pm

Violence is the unlawful exertion of physical force that:
(1) causes another person to sustain a physical or mental injury;
(2) causes another person to reasonably fear that a physical or mental injury will be sustained; or
(3) causes any damage to property not owned entirely by the person exerting the physical force.
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Re: Definition of Violence Working Group

Postby josephzitt » Tue Dec 13, 2011 2:11 pm

julia wrote:That being said, at this point I don't have a better suggestion for wording. (I'm assuming that intent is in here to exclude situations where you turn around really fast and manage to whack someone in the head or other actual accidental infliction of harm)


Intent would also be a factor in mutually-agreed BDSM relationships.
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Re: Definition of Violence Working Group

Postby josephzitt » Tue Dec 13, 2011 2:16 pm

88BG wrote:Violence is the unlawful exertion of physical force that:
(1) causes another person to sustain a physical or mental injury;
(2) causes another person to reasonably fear that a physical or mental injury will be sustained; or
(3) causes any damage to property not owned entirely by the person exerting the physical force.


This doesn't bring intent into the picture. It also suggests that either of the parties in the tent spray paint incident might be considered violent, depending on whether you believe that the placing of the hammer and sickle or its eradication were damage to property not owned entirely by the person doing it.
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Re: Definition of Violence Working Group

Postby Myfriendcamilo » Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:57 pm

88BG wrote:(3) causes any damage to property not owned entirely by the person exerting the physical force.

Hell to the no.

I'm not advocating vandalism, but to call it violence reduces any real meaning of the word.
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Re: Definition of Violence Working Group

Postby 88BG » Tue Dec 13, 2011 6:30 pm

Myfriendcamilo wrote:
88BG wrote:(3) causes any damage to property not owned entirely by the person exerting the physical force.

Hell to the no.

I'm not advocating vandalism, but to call it violence reduces any real meaning of the word.

Which word? Vandalism is an act of violence. If I pick up a brick and smash your cell phone to pieces, have I engaged in a violent act? I supposed you could stick the word "intentional" after the word "unlawful", if you thought that would be helpful.
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